Rare archival Batman Forever PR interview unearthed

A few years ago I picked up this old audio reel labelled "Batman Forever" and recently I got it converted.

It's a fun little piece of the movie's marketing that I don't think has been heard before. I assume it was done as audio and sent over to radio stations to promote the movie. If anyone knows any more, please let me know.

It contains some clips from the film, interviews with four cast members and the director followed by a short excerpt of Elliot Goldenthal's score.

In this video, I give a few thoughts and then play the whole thing. 

Again, if you think I've missed anything important, let me know in the comments. I wasn't sure if the film clips were slightly different from the finished film and didn't have a chance to compare them.

If you'd rather, you can download the mp3 to listen to yourself here.

Or if you want to read it, I've done a transcription of the interviews below. 

Beware though, there are no interviewer questions so it can seem at times that the interviewee is rambling a little. I kind of enjoyed how laid back and unpolished it is though.

VAL KILMER ON BRUCE WAYNE: He has an office, a desk, a secretary. He doesn't stay there very long. He shows up every now and again, kind of like Howard Hughes. Hughes actually didn't have an office. He would just show up. He would know everything. It's sort of that style. It's very specific and it's really grand. Everything is big. It's so big. We shot at Universal as well as Warner Brothers and down in Long Beach. There's not enough space in Warner Brothers, so we rented some more. It's a big world, Gotham. 

One of the main themes is identity. Harvey Two-Face is the easiest example because he split right down the middle. But Bruce Wayne's dilemma has to do with himself and his past, but the result of how he reacted to his parents being murdered by a psychopath was to become Batman. And is it a good thing and why should he continue and can he have a life without being Batman? And his personal story is mirrored in Dick Grayson's story, his parents' die and he's consumed with revenge. He can't think about anything else and he has his own personal journey about being split, about what he knows is really right and what he feels he needs to do about getting revenge.

VAL KILMER ON CHOOSING THE ROLE: It really, truly was everything about it. It's extremely captivating, obviously. It almost feels odd talking about the things, about the entity of the story about Batman because everybody knows it. This 50 years has maintained this interest. 

There's something really elemental that Bob Kane created. He was around quite a bit, which I was really happy about, because what he created was really extraordinary. He was just a kid when he started. I think he was 19 or 20, right before the Second World War. And what he did in the comic books, which is maintained and started many different styles, of storytelling really that he created or encapsulated quite radical corrupt politicians and he was dealing with current events at the time in this highly stylized way and all quite serious if you want to look at it that way. And why it's so successful is it also hits readers, audiences in all of its manifestations in a vivid and entertaining way obviously. We like the stuff. 

It was kind of almost disappointing sometimes when kids would be on the set because I would want to do my voice and do a cape routine or something and they weren't interested. The image of it, their minds go off. You get this highly concentrated, glazed look. And I knew there was nothing I could do. The soup sort of took care of it all.

TOMMY LEE JONES ON CHOOSING THE ROLE: It was just a great deal of fun. to be a comic book character. I mean, ordinarily I look for certain subtleties that a comic book doesn't concern itself with. So it was liberating, of course, to be a comic book villain. 

Yes, I mean, I'd never heard of Harvey Two-Face, even though I'd read the comic books when I was a child. If I had heard of Harvey, I had only a vague memory of it. But my son knew who he was immediately and was very enthusiastic about the movie. In fact, he was enthusiastic about it sooner than I was, which is to say instantly. It took me a little bit longer to talk myself into it. And it was his enthusiasm that was decisive for me, really. 

Two Face is, just, he believes in brute force. I mean, his plan is to kill Batman. It's that simple. One of his plans, usually what he tries to do is set a trap for Batman. He'll wreck havoc and wait until the bat comes to restore order and try to ambush him. He does that on several occasions. That's his modus operandi. 

Well, at first he's insisted that anyone could break into his high hideout. But when the Riddler suggests that he may have a way to learn Batman's identity and then render him helpless and then hurt him and then kill him, Harvey is very pleased to enter into a partnership with the Riddler. Of course the Riddler's character changes all the time. Harvey's character does not. They're more consistent.

JIM CARREY PLAYING THE RIDDLER: I thought about that. I thought about who I might be, and I think the Riddler is pretty much perfect. It would have been the Riddler or the Joker, you know, one of the two. I think he hated Bruce Wayne to begin with. He hated him because he had everything that he wanted. And I think that's how that starts. It really isn't about really loving somebody. It's about not loving yourself and seeing somebody who is the guy that you'd love to be and resenting him for it. And that's how it basically snowballs. 

It's just a great character because it's, I mean, he starts out pretty much bonkers to begin with, but it just takes on different forms and he gets so full of you know, just energy and evil power. You just can't help but love playing that. It's the ultimate juice master. Basically it saps the IQ from whoever watches the television that it's hooked up to and redirects the brain waves into Edward Nygma's skull. And so he's sucking Gotham's brain waves. He's devouring people's IQ and so he just you know becomes a mega intellect although he's mad you know so I mean intellect with madness is kind of a fun combination you know I just I love the character because you know it's basically he realizes that you know it's not who has the answers it's who knows the questions?

I thought I looked a lot like Michelle Pfeiffer, actually. He's not a very physical guy, except for he's very flamboyant. He's very, he's very, he's got a little touch of Fred Astaire, a panache – a joie de vivre. But, you know, but he's not going to hurt anybody with his fists, but he'll pick up a rock. That's where you have to be careful.

CHRIS O’DONNELL ON ROBIN: Robin's story is pretty close to the story of Robin in the comic books. He comes from the Flying Graysons, which, you know, he's from the circus. And he's lived on the circus all his life, which has kind of toughened him up a little bit. He's a little bit of a gypsy lifestyle. And, you know, he's a pretty cocky young guy until he has this, you know, traumatic experience. And he wants to be a part of the team as soon as he finds a Batcave. He sees everything down there, and he figures that's a way he can get back and avenge his parents' death, but Batman doesn't want him to be a part of him. At first he doesn't like Bruce Wayne and doesn't like Batman. Then Batman wants to protect him and doesn't want him to be a part of it. But after they kind of help each other out and save each other, they finally become a team. 

Well, yeah, I mean, they both saw their parents die before their eyes. And I think that is why Bruce Wayne offers to take in Dick Grayson - offer him a place to stay because he sympathizes for him. Dick Grayson, he kind of resents Bruce Wayne, some rich guy, who is Dick Dick Grayson thinks he's just kind of, of himself as being kind of a tough guy, you know, been living on the road and wants nothing to do with it. But he is out to, you know, get two-faced and anything that can help him, he's going to take. So when he finds out that he's Batman and that he's got the Batcave and all that, he wants to be a part of it. And Batman, who realizes what it means to become a part of this, wants to protect him and saying he doesn't want him to be a part of it. But, they go through a course of events where they both end up saving each other and a partnership is formed. 

CHRIS O'DONNELL ON FILMING: I mean, there was a lot of fight scenes and I didn't have a problem with them as far as when they were choreographing these fight scenes. I picked up on them pretty quickly. And I think that was mainly because of the Three Musketeers, which I had worked on, with these really long sword fights, which took weeks to choreograph. These really intricate moves. I mean, a couple punches and a kick here or there, it was like, wasn't that bad. 

But there were other things in this movie that you had to deal with that were tough. I mean, these suits are kind of constricting. They give you perfect posture, actually. Well, Robin is after Two-Face in particular, because Two-Face is responsible for the death of his family. So he really is out to get them and avenge their deaths. I figure out a way to get down to the Batcave and I find the Batmobile. And Dick Grayson decides it would be fun to take the old Batmobile for a spin, probably do pretty well with the ladies out in the city cruising around the Batmobile. And in the course of cruising around Gotham City, I find a young lady in distress who's being chased by a gang of hoodlums. So I come to the rescue. When they see the Batmobile, everyone thinks it's the Batman himself, but it's just me. Batmobile is pretty cool. 

Batmobile is very cool. I'd like to take it home, but I don't think that's going to happen. I think you'll probably get from here to Chicago in about - very quickly. I don't know when Robin's going to get his own toys, though, you know. It's about time. What about Robin? You know, I got a motorcycle. Can't they spruce it up and give me the Robin, Mo-cycle or mobile?

JOEL SCHUMACHER MAKING THE FILM: It was the most fun I've ever had in my life making a movie. And I've really enjoyed myself on all my movies. But this was the most fun. The cast was so much fun. And the crew was so much fun. But making, I wanted to make a living comic book. And you know, when you're doing a comic book, the reality police aren't hanging over your shoulder all the time. So you have the license to really use all the imaginative and creative people around you. And the cast was wonderful. They all had a lot of great ideas. And even though it's the third of the Warner Brothers Batman movies, it was our first. So for us, it was the first time and it was, and the cast the first time. So it was really exciting. 

It was exciting to go to work every day. Comic books. Batman's been around since 1939 and so the first thing I did was call DC Comics and I got as many comics as I could get my hands on from 1939 right up till now where there are extraordinary artists and storytellers working on them because there's so many different kinds of Batman comic books now. I just read hundreds of comic books for a long time, and it was great. I could read them on planes and in the doctor's office and wherever I was, because it was my job. But I'm sure everybody thought, what's this old hippie doing reading comic books? And I just immersed myself in the folklore, the legends, and the comic books. The wonderful use of color, the wonderful use of imagination, the stretch of imagination, the fun of scaling buildings with Batman. 

JOEL SCHUMACHER ON THE BATMAN CHARACTER: You know, I just got immersed in Batman's world and that was the real, the essence of the starting point. I think the one unique thing that separates him from a lot of superheroes is that he's a man. He's not a superman. He's a man with extraordinary power, I mean extraordinary human powers. He's a man whose parents were killed in front of him and who has become a vigilante by putting on this black bat suit. and going out at night and trying to right wrongs and he has all the vulnerabilities and all of the flaws and all of the human drama that any human being has. 

He's not perfect and he's not impenetrable. I've tried to structure a very strong story about duality because Batman is also Bruce Wayne. So there is a struggle for Bruce Wayne to find his identity insofar as why he ever became Batman. To think, to look back in his past as a child and the events that happened to him and why he became Batman. So there is a mythic quality to the revelation of that story, how he became Batman and he has a choice as a man now whether to continue to be Batman or not. And so the story is about duality and therefore everything that was created around that was to serve it.

JOEL SCHUMACHER ON THE NEW CHARACTERS: Dick Grayson, I brought in Dick Grayson who becomes Robin because his family has also been killed by a criminal. And he's a mirror of what happened to Bruce Wayne when he was younger. So he gets to relive that through another person. 

Nicole Kidman not only plays a criminologist who deals with dual personalities, she is in love with Batman and Bruce Wayne is in love with her. So she's having a triangle with the same two men. And then there's no greater character to show duality than Harvey Two-Face because you have Tommy Lee Jones as a man who is literally split in two. One side with the vestige of whatever rational judicious thinking he had as a district attorney and the other side a crazed maniac killer. And then Jim Carrey's Riddler, the sign of the Riddler is a huge question mark. And so Jim is there as the Riddler to question Val's total identity. The Riddler questions Bruce Wayne and Batman's whole identity. And so the piece Hopefully you'll feel that the movie is somewhat about that, with lots of fun and games on top of this, of course. 

The Riddler in real Gotham life is Edward Nygma. And Edward Nygma in this particular version of Batman starts out as a techno nerd genius with egomaniacal plans to be a bigger and greater electronics genius than Bruce Wayne because Bruce Wayne, we've also introduced Wayne Enterprises into this Batman, which has classically always been the business, the industry that Bruce Wayne runs. And there's an electronics division. And he works for Bruce Wayne as one of the many people in white lab coats doing experiments and creating new ideas. But he actually wants to be bigger than Bruce Wayne. And so that begins a story of revenge and jealousy and competition that drive him over the edge. And he becomes the Riddler and a criminal and a psychotic and quite a foe to be dealt with. 

JOEL SCHUMACHER ON THE NEW GADGETS, VEHICLE AND SUITS: Well, the Batmobile is the mother of all gadgets, right? there are fabulous new bat bolos and batarangs and special batarangs, a great one that Val uses at the end of the movie. I don't want to tell you how. There's a brand new bat suit besides the one we created for the movie that Val wears most of the time. At the very end of the movie, he wears a brand new bat suit never seen before with much different looking and with extraordinary extra gadgets and powers and things that it does. And there's a gun. There's a gun that shoots out a blue ray that stuns people, that stuns bad guys. That's pretty exciting. There's a lot of winches and gadgets. 

And the Batmobile does a spectacular gadget trick during a car chase with Two-Face and Batman that I like A lot. And because Wayne Enterprises is partly an electronics empire, there are a lot of electronics, computers, technology, and Jim Carrey's invention in the movie is a holographic three-dimensional device that enhances your television set, but it also has a very insidious side effect that feeds his criminal mind. And so there's a lot of, it's kind of like the 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, and the year 2000 all smashed together in one city. Kind of like now, you know, kind of like LA.

Rare photos of Two-Face, Bruce and Batman in Batman Forever

Looking back through this blog, I’m reminded that when I first started I had a steady stream of rare photos and magazine scans to share. That slowed down a few years ago when my scanner broke, and since then I haven’t had many opportunities to digitise more material. I’m hoping to change that over the coming months and start posting more finds again.

I don't know about you but I get such a thrill looking back through old photos and occasionally uncovering something that’s been tucked away and unseen for years.

Recently, PropStore released another batch of photos featuring props from Batman Forever. Hidden among them were some newspapers containing these fantastic photos of Two-Face, Batman and Bruce Wayne.

I know this first image - Two-Face looking through his cell bars - has been around for a while, and a lot of us probably hoped it hinted at a deleted scene featuring him in prison. But I think now it was more likely just a posed promotional photo created for props like these.

Here’s a link to PropStore so you can check out the other Batman Forever props they currently have available.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Kilmer Batman and Batmobile figures from Blokees

It's amazing how much merchandise has come out related to the two Schumacher Batman films in the last few years. It's easy to overlook or miss stuff.

Luckily, I saw these Blokees figures pop up on eBay and snatched them up immediately. I thought they'd take an age to arrive from China but they took only a couple of days.

They are basically little blind box toys that you fit together (not unlike a capsule toy). Like a lot of merchandise that's come out recently, almost all the modern movie Batman and vehicles are covered. Weirdly, they included Adam West but skipped over George Clooney.

Still the Kilmer figure is cool and was fun to put together. I don't know about the Batmobile. It's kind of small and hardly any detail. 

Podcast: Episode 9 - Chris O'Donnell speaks on working with Val Kilmer

A few articles have popped up recently promoting Chris O'Donnell’s new TV series 911: Nashville. Naturally, some interviewers have taken the opportunity to revisit his time playing Robin in the Batman films.

One interview, published on People’s website, included some interesting comments from Chris about working with Val Kilmer. In this episode of the 1995Batman podcast, Drew dives into the article and shares his thoughts on what Chris had to say.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Val Kilmer Batman figure from Beast Kingdom

So I finally got both the Schumacher Batman figures from Beast Kingdom. I covered the George Clooney one over at 1997batman.com

I'd actually say that one was slightly better than this Val Kilmer one. The sculpt isn't too bad but the weirdly large gaps at the top of the legs let it down for me. As does the decision to go with a dark grey rather than metallic blue metal finish.

Still it is nice to have something at this scale and the accessories are neat. Hopefully the Riddler figure (which isn't out yet but the prototype looks great) will look good alongside it.

News: Val Kilmer has passed away aged 65

I don't want to write a typical obituary. Obituaries are always so cold and clinical. Reducing someone life to a handful of clipped sentences and a small photo. Saying nothing but vague niceties about the deceased. Things that the author never expressed when the person was alive.

If you just want to read a brief summary of Val Kilmer's life it's probably best to look elsewhere - I'm sure wikipedia is mostly correct. All the major newspapers will have a concise obituaries that covers all his highs and lows. Better yet, just go and watch the documentary from a few years back that Kilmer himself made, titled Val (2021). It covers his career in a very eloquent way and goes into some personal life stuff that I'm going to avoid.

Instead I'm going to waffle (can't think of a better word) for a few paragraphs about what Val meant to me. Val was an actor whose life was split into four parts. Rising fame. Declining fame. Ill health. And recovery.

He trained at the New York's famed Juilliard School in the early 1980s and bar a handful of off-Broadway theatre performances and one After School TV special (with a young Michelle Pfeiffer) managed to instantly get cast in a big screen movie role.

The film was Top Secret, an eclectic spoof movie that mostly took aim at 1950s Elvis movies and World War II movies. It speaks volumes to Val's talent that he managed to snag the lead role at such a young age. The part required not only acting but also comedic chops and singing ability. The film itself is very funny in places but it didn't quite have the hit rate of the directors' earlier film Airplane! Val really committed to the role though and it's a shame that he only did a handful more comedies after this because he's very funny. Also, of note to Batman Forever fans, he has a handful of scenes with Michael Gough.

His next two films were Real Genius and Top Gun. The former a light-hearted, sometimes surreal comedy about students working at a science and technology university. The latter a pulse-pounding military movie about jet pilots. It's here that I realised what range Val had. The laid back character of Chris Knight in Real Genius is a million miles away from the super intense 'Iceman' in Top Gun. I almost can't believe it's the same actor.

And I think that ability would follow him throughout his career. He always seemed a bit of a restless actor who really wanted to stretch himself with every part he played. Never trying to repeat any of his roles. He would bring something extra to the table when he was cast in a role. Sometimes this would really pay off, like Tombstone, in which he singlehandedly runs away with the film. Other times, it wouldn't pay off, such as his bizarre turn in The Island of Dr Moreau.

Throughout the late 80s and 90s his career would go up and down. Never quite maintaining a running streak. For a while he seemed to avoid anything too commercial. Instead, looking for interesting dramatic roles in films such as Thunderheart and Kill Me Again. 

Then in 1994 he was offered the lead role in the third Batman film after Michael Keaton stepped down. It was an offer that he was asked to accept without reading the script. As the story goes he was in a bat cave at the time doing early prep for The Ghost and the Darkness (who knows if this is just one of those cute Hollywood myths). Reading his autobiography - I'm Your Huckleberry - I think he accepted the part mostly as a commercial decision. He was already working on The Saint and saw the two franchises as being nice pay cheques that would allow him the freedom to do more interesting and rewarding indie work.

By his own account, shooting Batman Forever wasn't much fun. Although I think he enjoyed working Jim Carrey, he didn't get on with director Joel Schumacher, reportedly not speaking to him directly for two weeks. He absolutely loathed the rubber costume which he equated to being like an elderly man - you couldn't stand for long, you couldn't hear people very well and you had to get help to go pee.

Some of his character arc was cut from the film due to pacing but what remains in the film is pretty solid. He played Bruce Wayne as a man who is truly haunted by his past and his interactions with other people like Chase and Edward is awkward. His best moments in the film are when he lashes out at Chris O'Donnell's Dick Grayson:-

"So you're willing to take a life? Then it will happen this way: You make the kill. But your pain doesn't die with Harvey, it grows. So you run out into the night to find another face... and another and another... until one terrible morning you wake up and realize... that revenge has become your whole life. And you won't know why."

Due to the fraught relationship with director Joel Schumacher, he was not asked to return for Batman & Robin. He was also working on The Saint, a film reboot of the 60s TV show and long running book series by Leslie Charteris. I always wonder how different Batman & Robin would have been if Val had stayed on. Would he have brought a bit more gravitas to the film like he had to Batman Forever? I certainly feel like the Bruce and Alfred stuff might have been stronger.

Anyway, he went and did The Saint which is a bit underrated in my opinion. It's got some silly bits early on where he puts on a ton of disguises and tries to seduce Elizabeth Shue but it mostly works as an adult orientated thriller. It's strange to think how the Mission: Impossible series ran and ran and this just stopped after one film. Financially it did okay but I guess the enthusiasm wasn't there to go further.

I feel like The Saint was the point where Val's career started tailing off. The big budget lead roles were few and further between and when they did happen like 2000s Red Planet, they didn't perform well. Like a lot of actors he retreated to indie fare and DTV movies, started playing supporting roles rather than the lead. I can't speak for most of these because there's a lot I haven't seen. I did notice he did more than one film with 50 Cent. Two bright spots in the 2000s were Spartan - a thoughtful, wordy thriller from David Mamet that I need to give rewatch soon and Kiss Kiss Bang Bang - a comedic noir thriller from Shane Black that paired him with Robert Downey Jr (Pre-Marvel). Both are well worth checking out.

The other great film from the 2000s is MacGruber where Val gamely played the villain Dieter Von Cunth but I will admit 95% of the best jokes are Will Forte's. It was around this time that Val started doing a one-man theatre show playing the role of Mark Twain. He seemed to get real joy from doing this and continued for many years performing it. I was kind of surprised he didn't turn it into some kind of film but maybe he just enjoyed keeping it a stage experience. Working on it, honing it, giving it to audiences live.

In 2015 he was hospitalized for what turned out to be throat cancer. When he finally remerged in 2017 his appearance had changed dramatically. Now only able to speak by plugging a voice box into his trachea. He returned for a few more film roles but they were mostly brief appearances and his voice was either dubbed by someone else or his character was mute. I always felt conflicted by his appearance in Top Gun: Maverick. On the one hand, it was nice for Tom Cruise to find a role for his character but on the other, killing his character off and having a funeral felt... like pre-emptively acknowledging that he was close to death.

Maybe that's how Val felt too. I wrote his autobiography - a very honest but at times very brief series of scenes of his life. He also made his documentary Val. And he got into painting. He was always throwing up whatever he had recently painted on Twitter. His voice was gone but he was still clearly bursting with creativity. Desperate to express himself.

I saw that he had started doing comic convention appearances. Dutifully signing Bat merchandise and glossy photos. I hope it paid some bills and let him travel. I was kind of hoping he'd come to a convention near me one day.

I want to finish on what Val meant to me as a child. I remember seeing Batman Forever as a kid and thinking this guy was the coolest guy I'd ever seen. Handsome, debonair, able to charm the pants of Nicole Kidman. I remember making a mental note to check out as many of his other films as possible and watching those films led me to three things I still hold dear today.

The Doors - who I was obsessed with during my teenage years and bought every album. I would have never got into them without seeing the film.

The Saint - I own at least 25 novels and have all the old TV shows on DVD. Again, I was first exposed to the character through the film.

Batman - I didn't really care that much about Batman before seeing Batman Forever. But that film, his performance, he made me a lifelong fan of the character.

Like every actor who dies, they aren't really dead. They live on films. I'll definitely be watching some Val this weekend in his memory and I suggest you do the same.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Cookie Jar from Applause

This thing was a bit of grail for me. I've been looking for one of these for many years and finally found a decently priced one in eBay.

It's an enormous piece, that measure about 35cm tall and 30cm across. I can almost guarantee you NO ONE has ever used this to store cookies. However, it is a great bust of the Sonar Suit.

As I say in the video, I'm fairly certain this uses the same sculpt as the ceramic Batman head mug. The eye paint work however is much better.

Very glad to finally own this. Let me know in the comments what I should keep in it.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Batman figure from Hot Toys

Super excited to finally own one of these amazing Hot Toys Batman figures. My god are they expensive but the detail is superb.

This Batman one has some advantages over the Robin figure. For one, you get many more gadgets. The one I couldn't identify in the video I did find out later was the grapple hook that Batman fires when Claw Island starts rising into the air.

I would have love to have seen more but I guess they were restricting them to the ones he uses while wearing the Sonar Suit. Maybe if they do a Panther suit later they'll include the ones he uses during the bank heist.

Anyway, not a lot to critique. The sculpt is great and the face in particular in superb. I love that they included the ability to remove the eyes and replace them with the "Sonar Grid" ones. I think they should have been a bit more blue though.

Unfortunately, like the Robin figure, this one is also very difficult to pose in any kind of dynamic way. That's fine though, I tend to keep all my stuff in "museum poses" anyway.

Anyway, as I say in the video, lots more 1/6 scale figures to follow.

Book Review: Neon Knight Forever: The Legacy of Joel Schumacher’s Batman Duology by Tomasz Zaglewski

Review by Neil Rickatson

I have to preface this review and state that I am acknowledged twice within the text of this book. I will do my best to stay as impartial as possible. 

In today’s world everyone is very quick to compartmentalise every aspect of their life. Turn everything into a binary 0 or 1. Nothing is immune. I can’t throw a virtual rock on the internet without hitting “That’s the worst movie I ever saw” or “That’s the best movie I ever saw.” There is little room for any sort of nuance. And inevitably we end up with a handful of great movies that everyone universally agrees are great, and the rest go in a pile to the side to be left untouched. 

Logic dictates that only this first pile of great movies should be written about when actually I find much more satisfaction in looking at the other pile. For years, the Schumacher Batman movies have been dragged through the mud. On release Batman Forever was seen as a slick but empty exercise in commercial filmmaking. Batman & Robin by contrast was seen as an excessive, noisy, exhausting hollow product. Comic book fans, in particular, turned to the internet and railed against both films for multiple reasons: their deviation from the comics, their humorous take on the material and their style choices. 

And here’s the thing that bothered me. They didn’t let up. At all. No one was allowed to get a word in edgeways. So the narrative has been the Schumacher movies sucked, they have zero value and they should be talked about as briefly as possible. 

Thankfully time is a healer. After almost 30 years, Professor Tomasz Żaglewski (from the Institute of Cultural Studies, Adam Mickiewicz University, Poland) has taken the task of looking at both films and trying to find what their legacy is. To be clear this is not a book about the making of the films (though a little bit of that is covered here and there) but a book that examines how people thought about Schumacher’s Batman duology then and how they think about them now. 

Here is a quick overview of the topics covered:- 

Part 1 talks about the place of the Schumacher films in Batman fandom. How they are seen as being “wrong” because they did not have a dark and serious tone. How they were also out of step with where the character was in the comics at the time. It also talks about how difficult it is to pin down any kind of definitive Batman portrayal (very true) and looks at some of the various versions of Batman over the years. Some were familiar to me such as Dark Knight and Camp Knight. Others were new terms I hadn’t seen before Cute Knight, Toy Knight, Dad Knight! 

Part 2 looks in more detail at the elements around the movie. Joel Schumacher (often seen as a generic journeyman director) is viewed with a fresh lens. Seen as a director who kept coming back to “trespasser” characters and stories. There is also a look at the shift from Burton's version of Batman to Schumacher's version. Were they their own thing or was Schumacher attempting to tie both universes together? 

Part 3 looks at some of the talking points around the films. The figures (which some people thought were disappointing because you couldn't get a figure that looked like they did in the film). The video games which are not beloved due to their frustratingly clunky controls. And finally… the bat nipples that featured in both films and what an overblown fuss they caused. 

The final part looks at how the duology has shifted in terms of public perception over the years. How the films were not well reviewed at the time and B&R, in particular, had a disappointing (but not disastrous) box office. To today where the films enjoy a small and loyal fandom (this is where I come in - which was surreal to read). And finally ends by talking about the online push for an extended cut of Batman Forever. 

All in all, this is a great, very knowledgeable book with a fantastic grasp of the subject. Tomasz is – I believe from the introduction – sympathetic to Schumacher’s aims and picks through both Batman movies, finding all sorts of interesting and varied subject matter. He draws on all areas of prior Batman expertise – such as Will Brooker, William Uricchio and Roberta E. Pearson. 

I must confess the whole book even made me look at both Batman Forever and Batman & Robin with renewed respect. I particularly enjoyed the second part of the book which dealt with Joel. I recently have been going through all of Schumacher’s filmography and was delighted to be shown this idea in Neon Knight Forever that there is this unified “trespasser” theme that runs through many of his films (one of his last movies was even called Trespass – how did I miss that). There’s this thinking that Tim Burton was “the artist”, and Joel was a “studio shill” but the book makes great pains to remind us that Joel did have thematic elements that interested him and with these two Batman films he did have a vision – to make a “living comic book”. It might not have been beloved by everyone but there was thought put behind it all. He was not the toy and cartoon and merchandise-obsessed man that a lot of people think he was. 

The book also reminded me of various little moments that I’d filed away and forgotten or outright missed. Such as how, even though the continuity is sketchy at best, Batman & Robin is designed to be a progression from the Burton films. Joel wanted to evolve the character of Bruce Wayne to be in a different place from the beginning of the franchise. I also chuckled at some of the old reviews and comments about both films. Gene Siskel’s review of B&R as a “a sniggering, exhausting, overproduced extravaganza that has virtually all of the humanity pounded out of it in the name of an endless parade of stunt sequences”. In some ways he’s not wrong, there’s times I watch and feel the same way (other times I just go with it and enjoy the "extravaganza" and "endless parade of stunt sequences"). 

The book also compares - or rather brings up comparisons of - Batman & Robin to recent films such as Thor: Love and Thunder and Birds of Prey. The former (which I haven’t seen yet) is an interesting comparison because the Marvel Cinematic Universe for many years has been a success juggernaut yet even I was aware that online fans had roundly eviscerated the fourth Thor movie in similar ways to B&R. Criticising it’s campy, playful, comedic tone. Neon Knight Forever begins by citing MCU boss Kevin Feige talking (in 2009) about B&R being a watermark that “demanded a new way of doing things. It created the opportunity to do X-Men and Spider-Man, adaptations that respected the source material and adaptations that were not campy.” Interesting to see that 14 years later Feige is producing a new campy, comedic superhero movie that goes against these earlier words. Perhaps camp is a necessary outlet that must be brought out every few years – a sort of cyclical event – if nothing else for a bit of variety. Perhaps there is a limit to the public’s appetite for dark, serious superhero movies. Maybe we can't keep telling the same story, with the same tone over and over again.

There really isn’t much I can criticise the book about. I would have loved for it to be a little bit longer. I also would have loved to have seen the book cover a little more on the online reaction to Batman & Robin circa 1997 - I feel it was a watershed moment when the internet started to become infinitely more important in terms of film criticism than newspapers/journals/TV. It democratised film criticism for better and for worse. Ain’t It Cool News’ review of Batman & Robin which drew comparisons of the audience feeling like “survivors of Hiroshima” was - I feel - a lightning rod for comic book fans and set the tone for the next few decades of online film reviews. 

But maybe that’s for part 2. I certainly feel there’s more to be discussed about both these films. And hopefully now Tomasz has broken the seal, others will come forward to give Schumacher’s duology their own analysis. 

I thank Tomasz for writing such an eloquent book, it has given me much to think about and I urge anyone with a passing interest in Batman Forever and/or Batman & Robin to buy a copy.

Click here for a link to Neon Knight Forever

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Val Kilmer Batman figure from McFarlane

Merry Christmas everyone!

In a bit of Christmas kindness, a fan of www.1995batman.com reached out to me on Instagram and asked if I would be interested in the Val Kilmer figure from the recently released McFarlane Ultimate Batman Collection - a six figure set of all the most recent movie Batman actors.

I can't thank the guy enough for sending it to me. 

This is a really great figure and hopefully it will be released as a solo figure soon as part of a Batman Forever line.

It really captures the likeness of Val and the sonar suit. All the details are there, right down to the gold belt buckle. I particularly love that they've captured the metallic blue silver colour (something the vintage figures never really did).

Being a fan of vintage figures I wasn't aware how good articulation had gotten. The an crunch and should joints in particular are really well done. As is the flexible "pants" that allow the figure to look good as a statue and be able to be put in tons of poses.

One thing to note is that this figure has a cloth cape. When the solo figure comes out it may not. The solo George Clooney figure changed the cape to be a plastic one. So if you're like me an love cloth capes, get this one.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Bruce Wayne Target Variant by Kenner

Towards the end of Kenner's toyline Target (the US store) asked them to make a few exclusive repainted figures.

One of these was this variant of the Transforming Bruce Wayne figure. A straightforward repaint.

Decked out in metallic green and gold. It's a really nice colour scheme - maybe even better than the original flat blue and red.

However I'm not sure they needed to make Bruce Wayne's hair dark red. I'm sure they could have recoloured some other part of his body. Maybe given him a new coloured top or trousers.

Anyway, I love this figure. As I say in the video it might be my favourite Batman figure ever!

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Leaping Batman statue from Applause

Applause was a company that made several 12 inch cold cast statues for Batman Forever that I reviewed a while back.

But I knew there was one more statue that they produced and I wasn't able to get it until now.

It comes in a huge polystyrene box but is actually only about 8 inches high. It depicts Batman in the sonar suit leaping off a rooftop.

As I say in the video, I like how clever the figure is given that it is actually off the ground and is held in place by the cape. But the likeness and proportions are very cartoon-y and reminds me of the Batman Forever Kids illustration style (See the video I did on the Style Guide).

Anyway, it feels good to have all the Applause stuff now. 

New McFarlane Kilmer and Clooney figures coming soon

Todd McFarlane just announced a new 6 figure Ultimate Movie Collection of figures based on the most recent Batman movie actors. 

The set will retail for $119.99 and feature the following actors:-

Michael Keaton (1989 suit)

Val Kilmer (Sonar suit)

George Clooney (non-Ice suit)

Christian Bale (Dark Knight suit)

Ben Affleck (looks like the Tactical suit from Justice League without the goggles)

and Robert Pattinson 

Most are reissues of existing McFarlane figures but Kilmer and Clooney are brand new sculpts. Have a look at the pictures below and see what you think.

Here's a link to the McFarlane page:-

https://mcfarlane.com/toys/batman-the-ultimate-movie-collection-6-pack/

They are all 7 inches and come with one bat signal with interchangeable bat symbols! No batarangs or other gadgets have been mentioned.

I don't love the poseable heads (it makes them look less like the actual suits) but everything else seems really good. I particularly love that these have cloth capes. And I think the likeness (the mouth and chin) are pretty good - certainly much better than Mattel DC Multiverse figure of Kilmer from a few years ago.

Hopefully these will be able to be purchased separately at some point in the future.

There were rumours earlier in the year that McFarlane may released more figures from Batman Forever (Batman, Robin, Two Face and The Riddler) and Batman & Robin (Batman, Robin, Batgirl, Poison Ivy, Mr Freeze and Bane as a build-a-figure). 

Who knows if that will happen but this certainly makes it more likely.

I know Todd will never see this message but THANK YOU for not forgetting the Schumacher Batmans.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Batman vs The Riddler from Kenner

Sad to say we're really close to finishing the Kenner toyline. Only a few figures left. Even though these are only repaint I thought they were pretty interesting figures to cover.

The Movie Collection was a line of three 2-pack figures that were released in 1997 that packaged a Batman figure with one of the villains from Batman (1989), Batman Returns and Batman Forever.

For this they brought out the molds of Batman (Guardians of Gotham) and The Talking Riddler and gave them new paint colours. 

Unfortunately the colours aren't particularly revolutionary. And there's no fun missiles or backpacks. Still it's nice to have a couple more figures for the collection.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Cosbaby Batman and Robin figures from Hot Toys

If you liked the recent Funko Pop Batman Forever figures you might also be interested in this twin set of figures from Hot Toys from their Cosbaby line. Urgh I hate that name.

Anyway, the advantage with this particular set is that you get a Chris O'Donnell Robin figure (come on Funko get on making one). The price is a little higher than Funkos but the detail is a little better too. You get more than just a simple mouth and white button eyes.

I'll hopefully be picking up the Riddler and Two Face set too. If the forthcoming 6" life like Hot Toys figures are out of your price range these are a decent silver prize.

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Batarang Batman figure from Kenner

I'm getting pretty close now to having a complete set of the Batman Forever Kenner figures. This one took a while to track down. Had to get a boxed version as you don't see many loose ones about. It's also a bit of a nightmare to search for being that it's called 'Batarang Batman'. Wish they'd have come up with a more unique title there Kenner.

Anyway, the figure itself is kind of neat. The transculent green on the arms and legs add a dash of vibrant colour and I've got to give the designer points for not doing just another backpack/missile accessory. The twisting Batarang is kind of cool and works well for knocking over bad guy figures. As I say in the video I'm sure this is borrowed from the Scarecrow figures from the BTAS and Legend of the Dark Knight lines.

This is definitely one of the better figures in the Batman Forever line. The only thing that lets it down a bit is the flat purple chest.

Magazine Article: Sci Fi Universe July 1995

The second issue of Sci Fi Universe that covered Batman Forever is a lovely in-depth series of articles about various aspects of the film. One of the interesting things to note in this article is that there's an honesty to how rushed the production was. I know I already knew the budget but it bears repeating - this movie was made for $70 million!

There's also some interesting little bits of info like Joel talking about how they wrestled with coming up with the movie's title.

And Pat Hingle also gives lots of interesting insights. He even gives a gist of what the Marlon Wayans version of Robin was meant to be in Batman Returns (he must have had a great memory to remember that considering none of it was shot or in the final script).

Batman Forever Merchandise Review - Custom Fibreglass Batman Head

Another eBay find that's going to become a long term project. Managed to pick up this fibreglass head of Val Kilmer in the Sonar Suit cowl recently. It's a little rough and needs patching up but I think it has the potential to become the jewel in the crown of my collection... if I can get it painted right. Will update you on my progress. As always any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Riddle Me This - A brief follow up about the Schumacher Cut

Today is June 16th (the twenty sixth anniversary of the Batman Forever's release). 

There’s a big push to get the hashtag #ReleaseTheSchumacherCut trending on twitter to see if Warner Brothers will consider releasing an extended cut of Batman Forever. Following on from last week's video about the contents of the "Schumacher Cut" here's a few corrections and clarifications.  

If you want to see the stuff I talk about in these videos, go to twitter and let @ATT @hbomax @jasonkilar know that you want them to #ReleaseTheSchumacherCut

Batman Forever Press Kit - Part 4

Here is the final part of the Press Kit. Just a reminder if you want to see the whole thing as a PDF click here.